WEBVTT 00:11.550 --> 00:14.149 Welcome to DLA Dialogues , the podcast 00:14.149 --> 00:16.205 where we dive into DLA's mission and 00:16.205 --> 00:18.389 mindset . I'm your host Jake Boyer . 00:18.750 --> 00:20.639 I'm excited about today's episode 00:20.639 --> 00:22.694 because we have our first ever guest 00:22.694 --> 00:24.917 from outside the agency . Joe Brooks is 00:24.917 --> 00:27.030 an SES and the executive director of 00:27.030 --> 00:29.141 the Regional Sustainment Framework in 00:29.141 --> 00:31.197 the Office of the Secretary of War . 00:31.197 --> 00:33.086 We're also joined by Doctor Colin 00:33.086 --> 00:35.197 Williams , DLA's very own historian . 00:35.197 --> 00:37.530 Gentlemen , thanks for joining me today . 00:37.530 --> 00:40.090 Thank you . Joe , to start off , what 00:40.090 --> 00:42.090 exactly is the Regional Sustainment 00:42.090 --> 00:44.159 Framework or RSF ? For those who 00:44.159 --> 00:46.381 haven't heard about it , what is it and 00:46.381 --> 00:48.381 why is it important ? It's quite an 00:48.381 --> 00:50.603 honor to be on with all of y'all . Um , 00:50.603 --> 00:52.548 DLA is very close to me . I , uh , 00:52.548 --> 00:54.659 spent many years working there . Um , 00:54.720 --> 00:56.776 the mission is incredible , uh , the 00:56.776 --> 00:58.942 people are incredible , and , uh , the 00:58.942 --> 01:00.998 resources are also incredible . So , 01:00.998 --> 01:02.887 Big thanks to everyone involved . 01:02.900 --> 01:04.789 Regional sustainment framework is 01:04.789 --> 01:07.011 simply put , making sure our warfighter 01:07.011 --> 01:09.344 has what they need , where they need it , 01:09.344 --> 01:11.456 and when they need it . Um , over the 01:11.456 --> 01:13.930 last , I don't know , 30 years , we've 01:13.930 --> 01:16.370 become very centralized in our approach 01:16.370 --> 01:18.203 to sustainment , our approach to 01:18.203 --> 01:20.537 logistics , our approach to maintenance . 01:20.537 --> 01:22.814 Now , there are efficiencies from that . 01:22.889 --> 01:24.739 There are benefits for security 01:24.739 --> 01:27.129 purposes to being so centralized , but 01:27.129 --> 01:29.569 there are significant downsides . And 01:29.569 --> 01:31.736 so what regional sustainment framework 01:31.736 --> 01:33.736 aims to do is to complement what we 01:33.736 --> 01:35.958 already have in terms of centralization 01:35.958 --> 01:37.847 with capabilities forward . Those 01:37.847 --> 01:40.419 capabilities To maintain , to sustain , 01:41.099 --> 01:42.988 broadly speaking , to conduct the 01:42.988 --> 01:44.879 logistics forward will allow our 01:44.879 --> 01:46.490 combatant commanders and our 01:46.490 --> 01:48.760 warfighters to have assets and 01:48.760 --> 01:51.339 capabilities to sustain the fight 01:52.080 --> 01:54.360 closer to the point of need . And what 01:54.360 --> 01:57.190 that means is greater readiness , 01:57.400 --> 02:00.639 greater availability . It also means 02:00.639 --> 02:02.760 more options for the combatant 02:02.760 --> 02:04.538 commander . Now , the combatant 02:04.538 --> 02:07.040 commander doesn't have to send an item 02:07.040 --> 02:10.050 back to the United States . To get that , 02:10.179 --> 02:12.401 uh , item repaired , to get that item , 02:12.401 --> 02:14.401 uh , refit , they can do it forward 02:14.401 --> 02:16.568 with an ally and a partner . The other 02:16.568 --> 02:18.512 benefit is something called burden 02:18.512 --> 02:20.290 sharing . Burden sharing can be 02:20.290 --> 02:22.346 anything from cost sharing to access 02:22.346 --> 02:25.529 and to , um , assistance . And so we're 02:25.529 --> 02:27.850 working with partners to identify those 02:27.850 --> 02:30.559 efficiencies , um , so we can do that 02:30.559 --> 02:32.726 maintenance forward and share a little 02:32.726 --> 02:34.948 bit of the cost , share a little bit of 02:34.948 --> 02:36.940 the burden with them . So it's an 02:36.940 --> 02:39.051 outstanding ability , outstanding way 02:39.051 --> 02:41.218 for us to take advantage of increasing 02:41.218 --> 02:43.440 defense expenditures worldwide with our 02:43.440 --> 02:45.718 partners and allies . And also , again , 02:45.718 --> 02:47.889 find those efficiencies that will also 02:47.889 --> 02:51.190 promote readiness . Colin , you're our 02:51.190 --> 02:53.630 logistics historian . What were some of 02:53.630 --> 02:55.186 the moments in history when 02:55.186 --> 02:57.408 partnerships really defined how America 02:57.408 --> 02:59.463 fought our wars , especially when it 02:59.463 --> 03:01.408 comes to being able to support and 03:01.408 --> 03:03.574 sustain our forces ? Well , you can go 03:03.574 --> 03:05.908 back in time to the American Revolution , 03:05.908 --> 03:08.074 and right now we are commemorating the 03:08.074 --> 03:10.241 250th anniversary of the Revolutionary 03:10.241 --> 03:12.830 War . People don't know just how 03:12.830 --> 03:15.229 dependent the United States was on 03:15.229 --> 03:17.869 France during the conflict . Dependent 03:17.869 --> 03:20.529 for finances . For diplomatic 03:20.529 --> 03:22.979 recognition , for weapons , both 03:22.979 --> 03:25.960 muskets and artillery . In the last few 03:25.960 --> 03:28.016 years we depended on the French army 03:28.820 --> 03:32.139 and in The last major conflict of the 03:32.139 --> 03:34.820 war , last major battle , which was 03:34.820 --> 03:36.876 Yorktown , we depended on the French 03:36.876 --> 03:39.789 Navy . Throughout the whole conflict 03:39.789 --> 03:42.000 though , we depended on the French for 03:42.000 --> 03:44.229 gunpowder , and we didn't make much 03:44.229 --> 03:46.396 gunpowder in the United States for the 03:46.396 --> 03:48.830 eight year long conflict . So what we 03:48.830 --> 03:52.570 used , we took from the British or 03:52.990 --> 03:55.910 we were given to by the French . Now we 03:55.910 --> 03:58.990 jump forward 140 or so years in time to 03:58.990 --> 04:01.470 the First World War . And again , we 04:01.470 --> 04:04.309 are dependent on France . We didn't 04:04.309 --> 04:06.142 want to fight this conflict . We 04:06.142 --> 04:08.253 weren't prepared to fight it , and we 04:08.253 --> 04:10.365 learned once we were forced to get in 04:10.365 --> 04:12.929 it , that it took more time to develop 04:12.990 --> 04:16.450 a defense industrial base than to draft . 04:17.619 --> 04:21.118 Train and deploy overseas men . So what 04:21.118 --> 04:23.174 does this mean ? This means that the 04:23.174 --> 04:25.174 weapon that most servicemen used in 04:25.174 --> 04:27.769 France was a British Enfield rifle . 04:28.640 --> 04:30.589 When we got our troops to France , 04:30.899 --> 04:34.440 France gave us artillery pieces , gave 04:34.440 --> 04:36.920 us tanks , gave us airplanes , not only 04:36.920 --> 04:39.440 gave us this equipment , but taught us 04:39.720 --> 04:42.380 how to use it and how to maintain it . 04:43.359 --> 04:45.581 Now we jump forward just one generation 04:45.581 --> 04:47.748 into the future and this is the Second 04:47.748 --> 04:49.748 World War . Due to some things that 04:49.748 --> 04:51.915 President Roosevelt had done , we were 04:51.915 --> 04:54.081 ready for this conflict . At least our 04:54.081 --> 04:56.192 defense industrial base was humming . 04:56.192 --> 04:59.980 And so because of a lot of factors , we 04:59.980 --> 05:02.220 became the arsenal of democracy . We 05:02.220 --> 05:04.387 weren't . Dependent on other nations , 05:04.440 --> 05:07.279 other nations were dependent on us . So 05:07.279 --> 05:09.390 based on that , Colin , what are some 05:09.390 --> 05:11.390 of the big lessons we keep learning 05:11.480 --> 05:13.091 about these partnerships and 05:13.091 --> 05:15.313 maintenance and support ? When you look 05:15.313 --> 05:18.700 at the Cold War , the post-Cold War , 05:19.000 --> 05:21.056 and the current threat environment , 05:21.056 --> 05:22.959 we're moving from dependencies to 05:22.959 --> 05:25.929 partnerships . And you can see this , I 05:25.929 --> 05:27.596 think , in 3 areas . One with 05:27.596 --> 05:29.649 commodities , another with weapons 05:29.649 --> 05:31.816 systems , and a third with what I call 05:31.816 --> 05:34.130 logistics services . With commodities , 05:34.250 --> 05:37.609 think food and fuel . So I'll give you 05:37.609 --> 05:40.839 a few examples . In Vietnam , more than 05:40.839 --> 05:43.529 half of the fuel that our service 05:43.529 --> 05:46.570 members used came from 3 contracts that 05:46.570 --> 05:49.049 DSA used to be known as Defense Supply 05:49.049 --> 05:53.019 Agency . with fuel contractors in the 05:53.019 --> 05:56.619 region , in Eastern Asia . And so this 05:56.619 --> 05:58.786 does a lot of the same things that the 05:58.786 --> 06:00.675 regional sustainment framework is 06:00.675 --> 06:02.786 trying to do today . Trying to supply 06:02.786 --> 06:04.730 at the point of need . When you're 06:04.730 --> 06:06.786 talking about weapons systems . We , 06:06.786 --> 06:08.897 the first thing you need to do is you 06:08.897 --> 06:11.008 have to have the same weapons systems 06:11.008 --> 06:10.940 as your allies . And we've been trying 06:10.940 --> 06:13.107 to push this in America for quite some 06:13.107 --> 06:15.540 time . Think of the F-16 , which is a 06:15.549 --> 06:18.559 fighter jet . Other fighter jets , F-15 06:18.559 --> 06:22.049 for some reasons the F-35 . It's not 06:22.049 --> 06:24.119 just America that uses these weapons 06:24.119 --> 06:26.341 systems , it's some of our partners and 06:26.341 --> 06:28.286 some of our allies . We talk about 06:28.286 --> 06:30.341 cataloging . This is something we've 06:30.341 --> 06:32.508 been doing for , for quite some time . 06:32.508 --> 06:35.859 But the most difficult services are MRO 06:36.079 --> 06:39.670 maintenance , repair , and overhaul . 06:39.980 --> 06:42.036 And we're getting to a point today . 06:42.059 --> 06:44.281 Based on the lessons we learned in this 06:44.281 --> 06:46.115 progression through the regional 06:46.115 --> 06:48.115 sustainment framework , we can have 06:48.115 --> 06:50.003 allies close to the point of need 06:50.003 --> 06:52.230 repair our equipment , and this is one 06:52.230 --> 06:54.670 of the brilliant things about the 06:54.670 --> 06:56.837 program that Joe was leading . DLA was 06:56.837 --> 06:59.549 doing RSF before it was a thing . DLA 06:59.549 --> 07:02.670 does tremendous work through um . Uh , 07:02.720 --> 07:04.720 Allied cross-servicing agreements , 07:04.730 --> 07:07.079 axes in transferring fuel currently and 07:07.079 --> 07:09.301 has been doing it for quite some time . 07:09.301 --> 07:10.912 You mentioned weapons system 07:10.912 --> 07:13.135 commonality and how important that is . 07:13.135 --> 07:15.519 Uh , DLA does about 1.2 billion in 07:15.519 --> 07:18.559 terms of FMS trade . That commonality , 07:18.799 --> 07:20.799 again , you're right to point out , 07:20.799 --> 07:23.000 it's essential , but I feel like we 07:23.000 --> 07:25.167 really need to take a moment to really 07:25.167 --> 07:27.167 acknowledge all the DLA has done to 07:27.167 --> 07:29.109 date to ensure that um , The 07:29.109 --> 07:31.276 fungibility of readiness , the , the , 07:31.276 --> 07:34.559 uh , the ability for us to be ready and 07:34.559 --> 07:36.726 have our partners be ready at the same 07:36.726 --> 07:40.140 time . It's , it's absolutely huge . So , 07:40.260 --> 07:42.316 so you both started poking at this a 07:42.316 --> 07:44.538 little bit , Colin , with your aircraft 07:45.000 --> 07:47.111 comments , and you , Joe , brought up 07:47.111 --> 07:49.333 FMS or foreign military sales . So if , 07:49.333 --> 07:51.667 if we can take it that way for a moment , 07:51.667 --> 07:53.730 um , Not just from a readiness , but 07:53.730 --> 07:55.952 from an economic perspective . How does 07:55.952 --> 07:58.008 what we do with our foreign military 07:58.008 --> 08:00.230 sales , how does that kind of tie in to 08:00.230 --> 08:02.397 the RSF ? One thing that FMS is aiming 08:02.397 --> 08:05.179 to do is to basically ensure that we 08:05.179 --> 08:07.401 have greater interoperability . What we 08:07.401 --> 08:09.859 want to do here is we want to make sure 08:09.859 --> 08:11.980 that our partners are flying similar 08:11.980 --> 08:13.924 aircraft , driving similar tanks , 08:13.940 --> 08:16.051 sailing similar ships , using similar 08:16.051 --> 08:18.273 weapons systems and platforms . Because 08:18.299 --> 08:20.410 what that enables us to do is through 08:20.579 --> 08:22.980 earlier I mentioned AXA , FMS , direct 08:22.980 --> 08:25.147 commercial sales , tons of authorities 08:25.147 --> 08:28.339 exist for us to be able to transfer 08:28.820 --> 08:32.489 equipment . And necessary supplies to 08:32.489 --> 08:34.489 the warfighter , no matter who that 08:34.489 --> 08:36.545 warfighter is , if it's an ally , if 08:36.545 --> 08:38.767 it's a partner , if it's a US soldier , 08:38.767 --> 08:40.767 sailor , serviceman , to be able to 08:40.767 --> 08:43.045 transfer that , um , when they need it , 08:43.045 --> 08:45.211 as they need it , where they need it . 08:45.211 --> 08:47.849 And so , again , the essentialness of 08:47.849 --> 08:50.016 the , the , the , the criticality that 08:50.016 --> 08:51.830 is of foreign military sales . 08:52.719 --> 08:54.663 Absolutely central to the point of 08:54.663 --> 08:56.719 regional sustainment . I'll add that 08:56.719 --> 08:58.900 this is incredibly difficult and 08:58.909 --> 09:01.076 history proves this . So in the latter 09:01.076 --> 09:03.830 part of the 1970s , Germany and America 09:03.830 --> 09:05.989 got together and tried to co-design a 09:05.989 --> 09:09.309 main battle tank . It didn't work out 09:09.309 --> 09:13.070 too well , but the idea was , was , 09:13.229 --> 09:15.229 was well thought through . So if we 09:15.229 --> 09:17.549 went to war with the Soviets in Europe , 09:17.909 --> 09:20.190 we'd have Germany and America using the 09:20.190 --> 09:22.669 same tanks . Both of them could be 09:22.669 --> 09:25.849 repaired , not just at the front line , 09:26.150 --> 09:29.090 but the depot level by German mechanics . 09:29.919 --> 09:32.380 This could have been transformative . 09:32.840 --> 09:35.630 In the end , the Germans built what's 09:35.630 --> 09:38.200 called the the Leopard II , which was a 09:38.200 --> 09:41.599 kick tank . And the Americans built 09:41.599 --> 09:43.710 something called the Abrahams , which 09:43.710 --> 09:45.599 is also kick , but was completely 09:45.599 --> 09:47.799 different . As we move forward and 09:47.799 --> 09:50.132 start looking at these new problem sets , 09:50.132 --> 09:52.355 one thing that you brought up is what's 09:52.355 --> 09:54.188 the biggest challenge that we're 09:54.188 --> 09:56.355 running into ? And perhaps the biggest 09:56.355 --> 09:58.521 challenge that we're also running into 09:58.521 --> 10:00.355 is getting that agreement . What 10:00.355 --> 10:02.632 regional sustainment framework is hope , 10:02.632 --> 10:04.743 uh , is , is preparing us for is that 10:04.743 --> 10:07.840 contingency where we have a conflict 10:07.840 --> 10:11.590 where that the figurative pie expands 10:11.590 --> 10:15.190 so rapidly . That there is no amount 10:15.190 --> 10:17.489 of existing supply that can satisfy 10:17.489 --> 10:19.679 demand . And so we have to be able to 10:19.679 --> 10:21.735 partner . Our allies are starting to 10:21.735 --> 10:23.512 realize this . Our partners are 10:23.512 --> 10:25.679 starting to realize this . Industry is 10:25.679 --> 10:27.901 starting to realize this , that we have 10:27.901 --> 10:30.068 to be ready for that rapidly expanding 10:30.068 --> 10:32.489 pie of demand . In time of crisis . And 10:32.489 --> 10:34.433 so regional statement framework is 10:34.433 --> 10:36.600 aimed at ensuring that not only we are 10:36.600 --> 10:38.767 prepared , but our allies are prepared 10:38.767 --> 10:38.650 in a way that is both fiscally 10:38.650 --> 10:41.330 responsible , but also responsible for 10:41.330 --> 10:43.497 the soldiers and sailors and marines , 10:43.497 --> 10:45.969 airmen , the warfighter . Because that 10:45.969 --> 10:48.136 warfighter can't be stuck with a piece 10:48.136 --> 10:50.358 of busted kit forward . They have to be 10:50.358 --> 10:52.469 able to repair that . They have to be 10:52.469 --> 10:54.525 able to have that . And by the way , 10:54.525 --> 10:53.840 they can't necessarily wait for that 10:53.840 --> 10:56.640 transit time . Our adversaries are 10:56.640 --> 10:58.473 developing capabilities and have 10:58.473 --> 11:00.251 developed capabilities that can 11:00.251 --> 11:02.418 intercept our lines of communication . 11:02.418 --> 11:04.640 Lines of communication , what does that 11:04.640 --> 11:04.039 mean ? I know I used a big word there , 11:04.119 --> 11:06.630 a big phrase . Basically our transit . 11:06.840 --> 11:09.062 They can intercept the planes and ships 11:09.062 --> 11:11.284 that are carrying our equipment back to 11:11.284 --> 11:13.451 the United States to get repaired . So 11:13.451 --> 11:15.562 we have to be able to anticipate that 11:15.562 --> 11:17.396 threat . And that's why regional 11:17.396 --> 11:19.507 sustainment is so important . We need 11:19.507 --> 11:21.562 to be able to sustain forward . What 11:21.562 --> 11:23.929 Joe's talking about is not just an idea . 11:24.150 --> 11:26.510 He's registering success right now . 11:26.900 --> 11:28.789 And if you want to brag about the 11:28.789 --> 11:30.956 agreement that Korean Air and Lockheed 11:30.956 --> 11:33.109 Martin just made for the repair of 11:33.109 --> 11:36.070 F-15s and F-16s in the Republic of 11:36.070 --> 11:38.237 Korea . Well , they've been doing that 11:38.237 --> 11:40.348 for quite some time . Korean Airlines 11:40.348 --> 11:42.459 has been a leader in that field , and 11:42.459 --> 11:44.570 they're seeing a lot of success . For 11:44.570 --> 11:46.626 instance , the F-16 now has 4 . 4000 11:46.626 --> 11:48.848 more hours in theater , because they're 11:48.848 --> 11:51.070 able to do that repair forward . That's 11:51.070 --> 11:53.237 huge , 4000 more flight hours . That's 11:53.237 --> 11:55.348 a lot more rains for the warfighter . 11:55.348 --> 11:57.403 We've been working very closely with 11:57.403 --> 11:59.570 the Koreans , Japanese , and others to 11:59.570 --> 12:01.570 ensure that we have that ability to 12:01.570 --> 12:03.737 repair , um , our watercraft forward . 12:03.737 --> 12:05.848 And so just last year , we managed to 12:05.848 --> 12:07.909 repair , um , a , uh , logistics 12:07.909 --> 12:09.909 support vessel , our army logistics 12:09.909 --> 12:12.076 support vessel . And we managed to cut 12:12.076 --> 12:14.020 off over a month of transit time . 12:14.020 --> 12:16.298 That's not including any time in queue , 12:16.298 --> 12:18.520 that's just a month of transit . By the 12:18.520 --> 12:18.179 way , when that ship is transiting , 12:18.299 --> 12:21.299 it's vulnerable , it's non-taskable . 12:21.659 --> 12:24.619 It's , it's out of the AOR . We're able 12:24.619 --> 12:26.841 to repair it inside the AOR so that the 12:26.841 --> 12:28.786 combatant commander still has that 12:28.786 --> 12:31.320 asset on the field . And is able to get 12:31.320 --> 12:34.159 it repaired quicker . At or below the 12:34.159 --> 12:36.770 same costs . We're , we're seeing 12:36.770 --> 12:39.830 tremendous benefits in terms of , uh , 12:39.840 --> 12:41.840 repair of components . So we always 12:41.840 --> 12:44.062 think about these platforms and weapons 12:44.062 --> 12:46.229 systems as , and by the way , I mean , 12:46.229 --> 12:48.451 we're all guilty of it . Fighter planes 12:48.451 --> 12:50.396 are really cool . So we , I mean , 12:50.396 --> 12:52.396 they're very interesting , um , the 12:52.396 --> 12:54.507 tanks as well , ships , but sometimes 12:54.507 --> 12:56.673 it's the things that make those , uh , 12:56.673 --> 12:58.840 weapon systems actually capable . Um , 12:58.840 --> 13:01.169 we take for granted how important it is 13:01.169 --> 13:03.169 that our weapon systems can talk to 13:03.169 --> 13:05.336 each other . Well , we partnered , one 13:05.336 --> 13:07.447 of our first pathfinders was actually 13:07.447 --> 13:09.391 on something called MIDS jitters , 13:09.391 --> 13:11.558 Multi-information Display System Joint 13:11.558 --> 13:13.669 tactical Radio . Um , and , uh , mids 13:13.669 --> 13:15.659 jitters is one of those items that 13:15.659 --> 13:17.826 allows us to talk to each other in the 13:17.826 --> 13:19.881 battle space , allows us to talk not 13:19.881 --> 13:22.048 only to our own forces , but to allied 13:22.048 --> 13:24.215 forces . Well , we were seeing large , 13:24.215 --> 13:26.849 uh , queue times just from transit . We 13:26.849 --> 13:29.809 cut off , I think it was 420 days off 13:29.809 --> 13:31.969 of the ability to test that equipment 13:31.969 --> 13:34.080 to make sure it's battlefield ready , 13:34.130 --> 13:35.963 um , and get it repaired . We're 13:35.963 --> 13:38.019 working with Australia on that right 13:38.019 --> 13:40.130 now , but we're able to cut that time 13:40.130 --> 13:42.186 down dramatically . Again , 420 some 13:42.186 --> 13:44.530 days . That's incredible . And that 13:44.530 --> 13:46.752 allows us to be able to communicate and 13:46.752 --> 13:48.752 have that assured communication and 13:48.752 --> 13:50.586 integration forward . One of the 13:50.586 --> 13:52.808 challenges we've run into with regional 13:52.808 --> 13:54.641 sustainment framework , which is 13:54.641 --> 13:56.919 reasonable , is , well , some items are 13:56.919 --> 13:59.599 very sensitive and sensitive in 13:59.599 --> 14:01.766 multiple ways , but sensitive in terms 14:01.766 --> 14:03.710 of security . Uh , we want to have 14:03.710 --> 14:05.655 those items maintained back in the 14:05.655 --> 14:07.710 United States for security reasons . 14:07.710 --> 14:09.932 That's understandable . However , a lot 14:09.932 --> 14:11.655 of times they're finding power 14:11.655 --> 14:13.580 inverters . Pumps , alternators , 14:14.070 --> 14:16.390 common use items , they're the source 14:16.390 --> 14:18.830 of failure forward . If we can work 14:18.830 --> 14:20.774 with our partners to repair them , 14:20.774 --> 14:22.552 which we are doing right now in 14:22.552 --> 14:24.441 countries like Qatar , we can get 14:24.441 --> 14:26.539 higher levels of readiness . Right 14:26.539 --> 14:28.706 there , forward . Regional sustainment 14:28.706 --> 14:30.872 framework is really about finding that 14:30.872 --> 14:32.872 healthy medium , where we're taking 14:32.872 --> 14:34.872 advantage of our capabilities , but 14:34.872 --> 14:37.095 also those of our allies and partners , 14:37.095 --> 14:39.317 raising our readiness together and also 14:39.317 --> 14:41.428 controlling costs together . Um , but 14:41.428 --> 14:43.650 that's what we're going for right now . 14:43.650 --> 14:45.983 This has just been a great conversation , 14:45.983 --> 14:45.140 guys , and we're going to get to the 14:45.140 --> 14:47.362 lightning round here in just a moment . 14:47.362 --> 14:49.580 But before we do , what is one thing 14:49.580 --> 14:51.747 each of you , and then we'll go to Joe 14:51.747 --> 14:53.913 first , would like our viewers to take 14:53.913 --> 14:56.191 home from this conversation ? You know , 14:56.191 --> 14:58.247 a lot of times we see logistics as a 14:58.247 --> 15:00.413 trade space . Um , and by the way , we 15:00.413 --> 15:02.636 do this in our own lives . I mean , how 15:02.636 --> 15:04.247 many times have you seen the 15:04.247 --> 15:06.580 maintenance required pop up on your car ? 15:06.580 --> 15:08.747 I said , you know what , I can , I can 15:08.747 --> 15:10.858 wait another month . Well , with your 15:10.858 --> 15:12.969 car , there , there are lives in it . 15:13.090 --> 15:15.257 Uh , not only yours , but the lives of 15:15.257 --> 15:17.312 the drivers around you . You have to 15:17.312 --> 15:19.423 maintain that vehicle . So as much as 15:19.423 --> 15:21.701 there's this kind of sentiment of , oh , 15:21.701 --> 15:23.757 I can put this off , you know in the 15:23.757 --> 15:25.479 back of your head , I probably 15:25.479 --> 15:25.289 shouldn't . I probably need to get 15:25.289 --> 15:27.345 those new tires . I probably need to 15:27.345 --> 15:29.400 get that oil changed because I don't 15:29.400 --> 15:28.770 want to get stranded . I don't want to 15:28.770 --> 15:32.719 have an accident . With the 15:32.719 --> 15:35.000 sustainment of forces forward , it's so 15:35.000 --> 15:38.119 easy for us to forget that real lives , 15:38.479 --> 15:40.312 our soldiers , our sailors , our 15:40.312 --> 15:42.368 marines , our airmen , our guardians 15:42.368 --> 15:44.280 forward , they all depend on this 15:44.280 --> 15:46.799 equipment . And so it's easy for us to 15:46.799 --> 15:49.077 say , well , that's a trade space . No , 15:49.077 --> 15:51.243 it's not . It's not a trade space . We 15:51.243 --> 15:53.466 need to invest in our sustainment . Our 15:53.466 --> 15:55.577 sustainment is how we ensure that not 15:55.577 --> 15:57.743 only we're able to fight tonight , but 15:57.743 --> 15:57.580 tomorrow , that we're able to get back 15:57.580 --> 15:59.799 up and strike back when the adversary 15:59.799 --> 16:02.599 knocks us down . We're we're going to 16:02.599 --> 16:04.655 face some challenges in the years to 16:04.655 --> 16:06.655 come . And the best way to confront 16:06.655 --> 16:08.830 those challenges is to be ready . And 16:08.830 --> 16:11.510 sustainment is part of that . An 16:11.510 --> 16:13.621 essential part and a part that is not 16:13.621 --> 16:15.732 as much of a trade space as sometimes 16:15.732 --> 16:19.419 we We may think it may be . We have 16:19.419 --> 16:21.363 to prepare , we have to be able to 16:21.363 --> 16:23.586 invest in our own sustainment . And our 16:23.586 --> 16:27.309 allies realize this too . Colin . I 16:27.309 --> 16:30.210 have a philosophical comment . You 16:30.210 --> 16:33.210 study the past sometimes because it 16:33.210 --> 16:35.929 rhymes with the present , but you also 16:35.929 --> 16:37.969 sometimes study the past because it 16:37.969 --> 16:41.049 shows an evolution , and that's where I 16:41.049 --> 16:43.049 think we're leading to when we talk 16:43.049 --> 16:44.771 about the regional sustainment 16:44.771 --> 16:47.239 framework . Why ? Well , one , because 16:47.239 --> 16:49.406 we do have common weapons systems with 16:49.570 --> 16:52.289 many of our allies and partners . Why ? 16:52.690 --> 16:54.857 Because if you go back in time , yes , 16:54.929 --> 16:56.985 there was maintenance . I'm sure the 16:56.985 --> 16:59.750 Greek Hopolites , 4.5 centuries before 16:59.750 --> 17:01.972 Christ , had some sort of maintenance , 17:01.972 --> 17:04.139 but over time , maintenance has gotten 17:04.139 --> 17:07.130 more complex . Depot level maintenance , 17:07.290 --> 17:10.449 particularly more specialized weapon 17:10.449 --> 17:12.770 systems more complex and fewer in 17:12.770 --> 17:15.030 number . America doesn't have too many 17:15.290 --> 17:17.346 aircraft carriers , doesn't have too 17:17.346 --> 17:19.489 many B-2 bombers , and so the 17:19.489 --> 17:21.930 maintenance becomes all that more 17:21.930 --> 17:24.969 important to maintain firepower , to 17:24.969 --> 17:27.880 maintain readiness . Another thing you 17:27.880 --> 17:29.880 got to look at , and this is what I 17:29.880 --> 17:31.991 really think uh history leads to what 17:31.991 --> 17:35.109 Joe was just talking about . We 17:35.530 --> 17:37.308 spent blood , sweat , and tears 17:37.308 --> 17:40.390 defending Australia during World War II . 17:41.390 --> 17:43.668 We're reaping the benefits of that now . 17:43.750 --> 17:46.670 Australia is , is a partner . After 17:46.670 --> 17:49.510 World War II , we helped rebuild Japan 17:49.510 --> 17:53.030 and Germany , potential partners . 17:53.959 --> 17:57.670 Hugely potential partners . We 17:57.670 --> 18:00.670 fought for South Korea in the Korean 18:00.670 --> 18:04.380 War . We stayed in Korea . Korea was 18:04.380 --> 18:06.436 almost a pre-industrialized nation . 18:06.750 --> 18:09.109 Now it's an Asian tiger . We can depend 18:09.109 --> 18:11.930 on that . It has an amazingly complex 18:11.930 --> 18:15.270 and intricate economy . You can go on . 18:15.430 --> 18:18.550 I think our protection of Kuwait during 18:18.550 --> 18:20.494 the first Gulf War , we're reaping 18:20.494 --> 18:22.494 benefits from that . So some of the 18:22.494 --> 18:25.410 allies we need to help maintain forward , 18:25.859 --> 18:29.069 this is a consequence of our decisions 18:29.069 --> 18:32.569 in the past to defend freedom . So As 18:33.050 --> 18:35.383 an historian , as an American historian , 18:35.383 --> 18:37.717 that just , that just rings at my heart . 18:38.189 --> 18:40.189 I think , uh , that's the comment I 18:40.189 --> 18:42.245 want to make . It all comes around . 18:42.245 --> 18:44.356 All right , so we always like to wrap 18:44.356 --> 18:46.356 these discussions up with kind of a 18:46.356 --> 18:48.245 lightning round , some rapid fire 18:48.245 --> 18:50.245 questions . I'm gonna set the rules 18:50.245 --> 18:49.849 here since this is our first time with 18:49.849 --> 18:52.071 two guests . When I ask the questions , 18:52.071 --> 18:54.182 Colin , you're gonna go first . Joe , 18:54.182 --> 18:56.516 you're gonna wait for Colin . All right . 18:56.516 --> 18:58.182 Sounds good . You agree ? The 18:58.182 --> 19:00.460 pressure's on . All right . First step , 19:00.460 --> 19:02.516 what are you reading these days ? Oh 19:02.516 --> 19:04.460 gosh , I'm reading a lot of things 19:04.460 --> 19:06.738 right now . I'm reading a biography of , 19:06.738 --> 19:09.071 uh , Ida B . Wells , uh , uh , a famous . 19:09.979 --> 19:13.439 Writer , someone who was a journalist , 19:13.739 --> 19:15.517 and she's writing about all the 19:15.517 --> 19:17.628 different problems that America faced 19:17.628 --> 19:19.850 at the turn of the century , but she is 19:19.859 --> 19:22.300 focused on the lynching problem , at 19:22.300 --> 19:24.380 least that's what the book is . So 19:24.380 --> 19:26.547 that's the , the biography I'm reading 19:26.547 --> 19:28.658 right now . I'm reading some military 19:28.658 --> 19:30.869 histories published by the Green Book 19:30.869 --> 19:33.036 Series published by the US Army Center 19:33.036 --> 19:35.202 of Military History . I'm also writing 19:35.202 --> 19:37.313 a book . I spent a lot of my time not 19:37.313 --> 19:39.147 just reading , but writing . I'm 19:39.147 --> 19:41.036 writing a book about How New York 19:41.036 --> 19:43.199 transformed during the American 19:43.199 --> 19:46.180 Revolution from an incoherent 19:46.680 --> 19:49.380 colony to what we call the Empire State . 19:50.910 --> 19:53.589 Joe , uh , American Ulysses , uh , 19:53.750 --> 19:55.619 about Ulysses S . Grant , um , 19:56.170 --> 19:58.170 excellent , excellent biography , a 19:58.170 --> 20:00.392 transformative leader , um , and , uh , 20:00.392 --> 20:02.392 you know , very important figure in 20:02.392 --> 20:04.503 American and international politics . 20:04.503 --> 20:06.503 Um , I'm reading How Big Things Get 20:06.503 --> 20:08.226 Done . I'm also reading , um , 20:08.550 --> 20:10.780 rereading Freedom's Forge , which is , 20:10.790 --> 20:13.229 uh , largely about how we prepared for 20:13.229 --> 20:15.229 World War II . It's , it's , it's a 20:15.229 --> 20:17.451 phenomenal book . If anyone hasn't read 20:17.451 --> 20:19.785 it , please , it's worth multiple reads . 20:19.785 --> 20:22.118 Um , Siddhartha by Hermann Hess as well , 20:22.118 --> 20:24.340 um , it's just another fantastic read . 20:24.340 --> 20:26.396 Um , but those , those are the books 20:26.396 --> 20:28.618 I've been reading lately . Alright , on 20:28.618 --> 20:30.729 to the next question , Colin , what's 20:30.729 --> 20:33.209 your superpower ? What do you do better 20:33.209 --> 20:34.320 than anybody else ? 20:37.420 --> 20:40.500 When I write something , I edit , and 20:40.500 --> 20:42.739 then I edit it again , and then I edit 20:42.739 --> 20:45.569 a 3rd time . So I think my superpower 20:45.979 --> 20:48.300 is to delay submissions of work until I 20:48.300 --> 20:51.060 have it exactly the way I want it . Joe , 20:51.459 --> 20:53.126 what's your superpower ? Oh , 20:53.126 --> 20:55.181 enthusiasm has , has been cited more 20:55.181 --> 20:57.459 than once . Uh , I think everybody in 20:57.459 --> 20:59.626 this room knows that . Yeah , no , I , 20:59.626 --> 21:01.681 I , I tend to get very excited about 21:01.681 --> 21:03.681 what I get to work on . Uh , it's a 21:03.681 --> 21:05.737 real pleasure to do the kind of work 21:05.737 --> 21:07.903 that we do , um . And it kind of fills 21:07.903 --> 21:10.015 you with purpose , uh , which is also 21:10.050 --> 21:13.449 very helpful . Um , one other thing I 21:13.449 --> 21:16.109 think You know , and I'm trying to get 21:16.109 --> 21:18.276 my kids into playing music right now . 21:18.599 --> 21:21.280 I did a lot of , uh , music . I'm , I'm 21:21.280 --> 21:23.920 a drummer , and I learned from that the 21:23.920 --> 21:26.010 ability to play jazz , the ability , 21:26.040 --> 21:28.151 and what I mean broadly by that , not 21:28.151 --> 21:30.229 just the style , but the ability to 21:30.229 --> 21:32.729 improvise , the ability to take a 21:32.729 --> 21:34.896 situation . And make something of it . 21:35.060 --> 21:37.227 Um , I think that's very essential and 21:37.227 --> 21:40.020 I think it kind of has helped me out 21:40.020 --> 21:42.131 quite a bit . All right , we're going 21:42.131 --> 21:43.964 to land the plane with this last 21:43.964 --> 21:45.964 question . What's your kryptonite ? 21:46.280 --> 21:48.224 Told us what's great . What's your 21:48.224 --> 21:50.800 weakness ? Well , you know , um , 21:51.469 --> 21:53.691 sometimes it's , it's , uh , planning . 21:53.829 --> 21:56.051 It can be a little bit of my weakness , 21:56.051 --> 21:58.107 um , you know , as much as I like to 21:58.107 --> 22:00.869 improvise , sometimes it's , uh , being 22:00.869 --> 22:03.390 as thorough of a planner . Um , it's 22:03.390 --> 22:05.501 something I've obviously been working 22:05.501 --> 22:07.557 on and , and , you know , managed to 22:07.557 --> 22:09.779 make it work , but it's , uh , it's not 22:09.779 --> 22:11.834 a natural inclination . I , I , um , 22:13.719 --> 22:16.739 And part of me really does enjoy , um , 22:17.040 --> 22:19.949 the thrill of getting involved in a 22:19.949 --> 22:22.500 situation and and appreciating the 22:22.500 --> 22:24.222 situation for what it is , not 22:24.222 --> 22:26.333 necessarily what you thought it would 22:26.333 --> 22:30.020 be . Um , so . OK , Colin , I think 22:30.020 --> 22:31.964 I understand history pretty well , 22:31.964 --> 22:34.160 military history . I got that down . 22:34.780 --> 22:36.558 Talk about political history or 22:36.558 --> 22:38.739 cultural history or social history , 22:39.060 --> 22:41.282 but when it comes to economic history , 22:41.300 --> 22:43.411 it befuddles me . I haven't been able 22:43.411 --> 22:47.329 to , uh , To convey 22:47.329 --> 22:51.030 how economics affects societies 22:51.459 --> 22:53.689 with the conviction that I need to in 22:53.689 --> 22:56.040 the past , and that's something that 22:57.150 --> 22:59.910 That weakens my interpretation . OK . 23:00.780 --> 23:02.947 Well gents , thank you so much both of 23:02.947 --> 23:04.947 you for being on the show today . I 23:04.947 --> 23:06.669 think it's been a really great 23:06.669 --> 23:08.724 conversation for DLA Dialogues . I'm 23:08.724 --> 23:11.058 Jake Boyer . Until next time , remember , 23:11.058 --> 23:12.947 learning is a superpower . Use it 23:12.947 --> 23:12.939 wisely .